An awkward and miserable wedding that had the distinct feel of a funeral, plus a “wedding” night where the sex toys were leeches. Not every little girl’s or boy’s dream. It’s all in “Second Sons” (Season 3, Episode 8).
Join us in a shot of mead and enjoy the perspective of three fans from very different perspectives: Laura Fletcher, a casual fan of the TV and book series; Corrin Bennett-Kill, a hardcore fan of the book and TV series (she has read all the books four times!); and Cheryl Collins, a TV show watcher who has never read the book series. Miss us last week? Catch up and read “The Bear and the Maiden Fair.”
Please join the discussion in comments!
Cheryl Collins
This episode was called “Second Sons,” and there were no signs of Robb, Jon, or Jamie — the “first” sons. It was Tywin, Gendry, and Sam — the neglected, benighted, overlooked offspring — who took center stage in this episode. We could even include the nameless infant son of Craster who keeps passing between the hands of Gilly and Sam.
Oh yes, and there is that group of malignant marauders with whom Dany faces off (and whom this episode is theoretically named after).
Corrin Bennett-Kill
Theoretically. I agree with your assessment, Cheryl. Whether they be second in the hearts of their fathers or second in birth order, this episode was all about the lesser sons stepping up, either from duty, honor, or motivations more base (read: the Hound’s desire for gold or Sam’s desire to impress and protect Gilly).
Cheryl
As this series is all about dualities and pairs, we get two “weddings” (including Melisandre and Gendry), and both call into question the notion of duty to the individual versus the collective.
Corrin
I think you can find examples of that dynamic all over this episode. Tyrion and Sansa do their duty to marry per the wishes of his family and her duty as a highborn lady. Edmure Tully does his duty to his king (Robb) in place of Robb fulfilling his responsibility. Stannis’s conversation with Ser Davos is about how he never asked to be king, but what lengths should he go to do the larger duty? What is the life of one bastard boy versus a kingdom? The push and pull between personal morality and duty to family and country is writ large in this story.
Laura Fletcher
I also liked seeing the contrast between how the Lannisters and the Tyrells view duty — and the public image necessary to go along with it. Cersei was all over that this week, with her public yet whispered smack-down of Margaery’s simpering sisterhood ploy and her private don’t-waste-my-time-with-niceties dismissal of Loras.
Cheryl
Right! Cersei is no willing lamb on the way to slaughter. However, Stannis tries to convince Davos that his “sacrifice” of Gendry is honorable. Also, Tywin tries to convince Tyrion that his duty to marry and impregnate Sansa is for the good of the realm.
Both Tyrion and Stannis in the end chose to follow their consciences (or at least I think Stannis did?): Tyrion did not sacrifice Sansa, and Gendry lived (and *only* has leeches attached to his penis).
Laura
The show gave Stannis’s story a lot of narrative space this week, culminating in the three leeches named for three “usurpers”: Robb, Joffrey, and Theon’s father Balon Greyjoy. So far we haven’t seen whether whatever curse this invoked has worked, and I wonder if we’ll see Theon’s family again before this season ends.
Cheryl
It was interesting to see Stannis name Balon Greyjoy as a usurper — I wondered if it was because it was a narrative necessity per the book or it means Theon (minus penis) will be back? Also, he doesn’t seem to question that the “battle in the snow” he saw in a vision was about him becoming king — he makes it mean what he wants it to mean.
Corrin
And Stannis is a second son. Robert was his older brother; Renly, his younger.
Cheryl
Stannis, again, is mostly shot in the shadows (with his “fires burning low”). Even the outdoor scenes with Stannis seem to be in overcast, sunless skies. He is in eclipse.
Laura
It’s interesting to consider the Hound as a second son — to the Mountain, his more infamous and ferocious brother.
Corrin
What was interesting about the Hound and Arya to me was Sandor’s self-awareness.
He paints himself in opposition to his brother, but makes his choices from a very emotional place. He cared for Sansa’s virtue. He paints his return of Arya to her family in the colors of a family reunion at the wedding. He even cares enough about Arya’s well-being to tell her about what he did for Sansa and give her the opportunity for escape. It seems as if he can only justify his own goodness of spirit in contrast to his brother’s evil.
Also, I love the Hound. That is all.
Cheryl
I love the Hound too! He paints what he does and why in very amoral terms, but there is a code there. (Essay question: compare and contrast the Hound’s morals with Littlefinger’s.) We know he wants to help her, he just won’t admit it.
So what about that other wedding? The next stop on the wedding train: Sansa and Tyrion.
Laura
It’s wedding season in Westeros!
Corrin
Well, I thought Tyrion was dear, trying to be considerate of his reluctant bride and giving her the consideration of conversation and understanding. It’s too bad that Sansa is too young to see past her visions of a gallant husband like Loras to the good, if short, man she is actually marrying.
Corrin
Then there was Joffrey and his douchebaggery. His attempts to frighten Sansa and humiliate his uncle brought him a very clear reminder that his Lannister relations are not to be trifled with. Joffrey may have been able to pretend that Tyrion’s threat to cut off his kingly junk was drunkenness, but deep down he knows it wasn’t. Joffrey isn’t the most dangerous member of his family.
Laura
That reminder that Sansa is 14 … we could’ve used that a couple episodes ago when Bronn was being all “go get her bro!” to Tyrion. Waiting until now, though, gave that extra degree of disgust to both Tywin’s insistence that Tyrion have sex with her and Joffrey’s rape threat.
Come to think of it, the Hound reminded us that Sansa was almost raped back a season. Damn, Game of Thrones, give Sansa a break from impending sexual violence!
Cheryl
And her undergarments were so formless and unsexy! No voluptuous curves there. Another reminder she is but a girl.
As for the wedding: it was a funereal, joyless wedding procession. Sansa entered the building as though entering a tomb. It seemed as if she was walking to the gallows.
Corrin
Cheryl, she was: it was the death of her youthful ideals. She has spent the entire series being lessoned in how foolish those fantasies were. Now she is fully in reality.
Cheryl
Plus, huge props to whomever does the lighting on this show — it’s all oranges versus blues. Somehow the inside of the sept where they got married was warm oranges with a cold blue light shot through, and as she entered, it just got bluer, colder — as though she were heading underwater.
Corrin
Let’s talk Sam the Slayer! Sam finally gets his nickname! Long past due, imo.
Loved the whole breakdown of that scene, especially the crows. My husband believes that the crows symbolize watchers such as Jojen Reed, Rattleshirt of the Wildlings, and Bran Stark. But Sam was the master of the ravens for Mormont. He failed in his duty to get a raven off to Castle Black during the attack on the Fist of the First Men. They could signify that failure just as Sam is about to be a hero. His redemption.
Or, they could just be a harbinger of doom. A warning.
It was awesome to see this particular second son (in the esteem of his father rather than birth order) show his guts for the audience to see.
Laura
Corrin, I’m with your husband on the birds — after all, they landed in the heart tree (with the face and the red leaves, the symbol of the ancient northern religion the Starks and others still follow).
Cheryl
To me that scene has a “Birds”-like feel as the crows begin to gather, then their calls hit a crescendo before going silent. Those crows following them as they ran away seemed to be about the chaos that will follow them to the Wall.
I liked the interaction between Gilly and Sam — Gilly seems to say, you know that fancy talk, but I know how to build a fire!
But it wasn’t smart that he dropped his dagger after killing the White Walker.
Corrin
You pick up the weapon that JUST KILLED A WHITE WALKER! I mean, really!
Cheryl
But he is an example of a real “knight” protecting his “lady.”
Laura
Is it time to talk about Dany and Daario Naharis?
Cheryl
I found this kind of boring.
Corrin
I think it’s obvious enough to say that Daario is being set up as a love interest for Dany.
Laura
I think I speak for many fangirls when I say that I wish the show had given Daario some of the book swagger — check out this fan illustration based on GRRM’s detailed description.
Corrin
Right! The blue hair! I’d forgotten.
Cheryl
Daario reminded me of Fabio from the 80s.
Corrin
I did think that the whole encounter with the captains of the Second Sons was a little heavy-handed. It seemed to rely too heavily on the shock value of Titan’s Bastard’s repeated use of the word “cunt” rather than interesting dialogue.
It seemed very much like a “we have to hit this plot point” scene in contrast to the subtlety of the rest of the episode.
Laura
Corrin, I agree. It was as if they were self-consciously trying to differentiate it from the previous scene with the slaver.
Cheryl
Well only two more episodes … what do we foresee?
Corrin
Let me look in my crystal ball: I think we will see the weddings to end this season. The Tully–Frey wedding and Joffrey and Margaery’s wedding. At this point there are so many possible stopping points, and I keep getting surprised by details I had forgotten from the books (Joffrey’s snatching of the stepladder at Tyrion’s wedding being a big one). I’m on pins and needles with the rest of y’all now!
Laura
I think we’ll also see some kind of indication of whether the Gendry-leeches work. Dany will make some kind of move against Yunkai, and I hope we get another glimpse at Littlefinger’s conniving plans!
Cheryl
How come I think Jaime will show up in King’s Landing just in time to catch Cersei and Loras’s wedding?
Question: Why the simulated sex between Melisandre and Gendry? Just to engorge his penis? I would think that the application of the first leech is kind of a buzz kill? Or was it simply more gratuitous sex? And did Stannis “save” Gendry, or did Melisandre decide not to sacrifice him?
Laura
I read that as her “hiding the knife from the lamb” and getting Gendry calm and relaxed before “slaughter” — which, for now, is just leeching.
I’m not sure if Gendry’s better off if the leeches work or fail, to be honest. He might be damned if they do …
Sad to see season this season drawing to a close or happy that it’s finally winding down? Please join the discussion in comments! (And no spoilers, please.)